Post Author: Bob
Hello guys and gals, this week’s Naruto chapter slows down the pace a bit by taking us into an extended flashback. I initially thought that having such a long winded flashback at this point in the story was unnecessary, but Kishi made it more digestible by adding in an appearance by Minato and letting us see the first encounter between him and the future Raikage. Since I’ve always been calling Raikage the “Raikage” in my reviews, I will continue to address him as such in this post even though during the time of this flashback he was still just known as “A” and his father was the real Raikage.
Despite the length of this flashback, it still felt rushed simply because Kishi was trying to cover way too many events in the timeline in the span of just 17 pages. We start with KB and Raikage just starting out in their partnership and growth as a tag-team, and then quickly move into the time the Hachibi was sealed in KB, then without pause we jump forwards again and witness the more developed Jinchurriki KB take part in an encounter with Minato. I can see Kishi is trying to wrap things up in this flashback in one or two chapters in order to not interrupt the main plot of the Ninja War for too long, but at the same time he’s trying to jam in as much as possible to build up on KB and Raikage’s character before returning to the current timeline. It’s obvious that the Raikage, and KB in particular, will play a vital role in the battle against Madara fairly soon… The bad thing is, flashbacks devoted to a specific character usually signify … something bad is going to happen down the line…
The flashback does reveal a lot about the youth of the KB we’ve come to known. Still, we know nothing about his lineage and origins, which is especially of interest now after we’ve learned he and Raikage are not actually related by blood. There must be something special about him that allowed him to so easily control and actually form a mutual bond with the Hachibi when so many before him have failed and died for it. Minato and that wannabe-KISS-groupie Jinchuuriki in this chapter, as well as Kushina in the past, have mentioned that key to controlling a tailed beast is to fill that hole inside them with something. KB obviously had that something and I think Naruto will discover the same with the Kyuubi eventually. I hope that something isn’t a cliché like “love”, but it might end up being different for each beast as each manifests differently.
Speaking of cliché, despite Minato’s awesome showing of “I–can-kick-your-ass-ten-times-over” skills against the Raikage, why did he have to leave the fight with some mushy family values quote? Way to ruin the mood of the moment, dude. But anyways, it was a good show by both sides for their first encounter, Minato was probably a bit older and more experienced than Raikage at the time, so he definitely had the edge on all accounts in this meeting. We also saw in this chapter that Minato’s specialty was not just about moving around really fast, it was also his lightning fast reaction time – or should I say faster-than-lightning reaction time because he clearly avoided and countered the Raikage’s lightning speed charge. This is pretty amazing considering that as far as we know, he has no powers or techniques to enhance perception abilities such as the Sharingan and Byakugan can. This is also something Naruto has begun to acquire because his senses have obviously been able to adjust to the super speed of his new form or else we would be seeing him landing into walls and hitting trees 
while just moving around. Like father like son I guess. Anyways, I still feel kind of dissatisfied by that encounter between Raikage and Minato. I’m willing to bet the Raikage trained crazy hard afterwards so that their next encounter would be worthy of a kage-level battle… the question is will we ever get the chance to see it?
Other interesting notes:
– Why are Hidden Earth ninja always the sacrificial “bad guy” grunts used in these flashbacks, that Tsuchikage was a quite a schemer I guess?
– When Raikage said Minato is the ninja who put a stop to their mission to recover the nine-tails, I wasn’t sure if he was talking about their current mission or something from the past. Minato did rescue Kushina from Kumogakure ninja when they tried to kidnap her (chapter 498) but back then she wasn’t even a host yet. Also, I find it strange that Raikage would use the word “recover” when the Kyuubi was never allocated to their village by the First Hokage. Either he’s referring to a time when the Kyuubi was released again (prior to sealing inside Kushina) and was free to capture by anyone or he’s talking about a time Kumogakure tried to kidnap Kushina… again. Maybe I’m just reading into it too much, but peace out.
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SHANNARO!!! 
wannabe-KISS-groupie Jinchuuriki .. that was like over the top awesome
Nice chapter.
I didn’t particularly enjoy this chapter, it centered around the three characters in this series I despise the most… It also seemed so out of place and unnecessary, but what I didn’t like most about this chapter is how the fanbase reacted too it…
Minatards really wanked through this chapter hard with people claiming Minato to be the strongest character ever… Not to mention how much of a Gary Stu Minato has become, I liked him better as a mysterious character we rarely ever see, but now Kishi has been shoving him down our throats with his constant “Oh Minato is untouchable! Oh he always has a smile on his face! Oh look at his smexy hair!” How Minato affects the fanbase too is really negative, he makes debating so much more tedious…
i definately wanked over the minato appearance!!!! for shizzle my dizzle on the nizzle!!! he was AWESOME!!! FTG!!! DO IT!
hey brokenbonds y u wana hate on minato?? dude’s a beast, his hair is awesome 😀
i noticed it too bob
the hidden earth nin are always taking alot of hit in the flashbacks….. and they seem to have info on every special ninja in other villages, like minato and now bee, and finally A
Minato is God. Pain would lose in seconds. Not even the Rikudou Sennin could do anything against him. Hell, I’m pretty sure he could oneshot the Juubi. He’s Kishi’s little pet so he’ll never even get a scratch.
Kisu knows what it is up, he’s nothing more than a Gary Stu now… =(
@BrokenBonds, EXACTLY! He’s like Aizen but less entertaining. It’s a shame too because Minato was so cool before…
Come on, guys, don’t be so bitter. 🙂 We saw Minato for few panels and then all this fuss! You all complain for seeing hundreds of Sasuke’s hate rants or Naruto’s friendship preaching. And yes, they are from boring to annoying. Now the story was primarily focused to the great A-B brothers, with few Minato’s mentions and you complain again! No one said anything about the actual chapter, which was basically good! We have to be more moderate to our judgement. 🙂
He will be forgotten later, like all other dead characters; we always learn about him by some little memories of other characters. Let’s find some things about him, now that we have this chance, and then the story will be back to the actual war. We have some great battles ahead, after all.
And Kisu, I explained about this “not a single scratch” thing, on the previous post, if you want to read. It’s clearly thanks to his technique, not because he is Kishi’s little pet. If I could find a way to appear, kill you and disappear (so quickly, like invisible), then yes, I could kill by myself an entire army without a single scratch. But in a face-to-face battle, things change; the one who has better speed, analytical skills and strength will win.
Im seeing a double-standard with the bashing of minato, almost every strong ninja that has been introduced in the series has been supposingly untouchable at some point. It start with gaara then itachi, jairaya, pein, hanzo, madara, and minato just to name a few. All of these ninjas were basses and seemingly unbeatable until what? They got beat. Pein lost to naruto (eventhough he kicked naruto’s ass) and minato lost to tobi (eventhough he kicked tobi’a and the fox’s ass). Why the hatred for one of the biggest bad ass ever.
@kisu
You keep sarcastically referring to minato as a god but aren’t you the one who said pein was god? What’s the difference?
I dispised this chapter. I thought the flashback was unnecisary as it just parroted everything we all ready know about jinchuriki. We didnt learn a whole lot annd it didnt progress the story.
First all we learned is that A fought minato and A and B are not related. Furthermore we get the fist=feelings sentiment parroted to us again. We all ready saw that with naruto and sasuke.
On to minato. He is my fav character. Too keep seeing him thrown at us is diminishing his character. We all know he is strong and based on what we have been told the strongest ninja ever. So too shoehorn him in at all places possible sucks.
If kishi wants to push his fav characters he should do something seperate of the storyline and not as a flashback. Similar to the way it was done with kakashi and jirayia
@Wo Ai Ni, my problem isn’t with just Minato’s “strength”, it has to do with all aspects of his “perfect” character. Everyone you mentioned (the 1st, 2nd and 3rd) all had huge character flaws and were presented as more dynamic characters. For Minato, you can define him in one word; “perfect”.
@Flip, I comment sarcastically about Minato because it’s like that’s the image of him Kishi wants to paint, that he is a god. Pain was overpowered, but it was shown he had weaknesses like everyone else.
@ Kisu
We don’t know yet about flaws. He had Jiraiya as his teacher, after all! 😉 He is a human, so he must have flaws. (Maybe that he could never win against Kushina! XD)
That’s why I said he is a rather unknown character and we have to learn something more to judge him better. Until now, he is indeed portrayed very great. However, we know about his skills and legacy, but nothing about his background that made him the person he was. We know about the background story of almost all characters, but this character that you call perfect and is quite basic after all, he is still mysterious.
Here’s the proof I was looking for all this time. (Just so we’re clear, this is the official Viz translation and not a fan translation.)
http://hjwsda.blu.livefilestore.com/y1plVfUMjeSsIeD4J4NfwxukJT8oVz7wrzvCDywihHQkTLKsZM-nauVLQw7iG5kUsxd47pe5TrkZK-A2hgZd_grLQ/Vol%2045,%20page%20131.jpg?psid=1
Either Sasuke was stronger than Minato, or Kishi decided to just throw him in there because he thought his Gary Stu needed more love
@Wo Ai Ni, this is all my own opinion so don’t be offended by it 🙂
What? the image of minato is god…ows, if that really is, he is still alive until now…his ability as what ive known so far is teleportation-like technique, super fast, ransengan and that summoning of the toad as well as the death God which killed him in the process..ive never seen him did other tech. for me what makes minato special is because he is calm and intellegent..thats all
@Kisu,
” Pain was overpowered, but it was shown he had weaknesses like everyone else.”
It was shown that Minato has weaknesses as well, his family, the village and close friends are his weaknesses just like Konan and the Rain village and Yahiko was was Peins. They both had the same goal to bring peace to the ninja world. What is so different about them? These things I listed are both their weaknesses and their strengths. Ninja are suppose to kill these emotions and both of them couldn’t, they are practically the same.
I completely agree Nicholas, the only techniques that made him great was the Rasengan and space/time tech. and maybe some sealing abilities but he doesn’t have the Rinnegan and all these God like powers as Pein does, which can bring people back to life. He just mastered his techniques to a level that made him stand out. Just like Bob said, his reflexes and perception is part of what makes him great and his analytic skills. Just like Jiraiya said he is was the true definition of a shinobi.
I just don’t understand why people are trying to paint the guy as perfect when Pein had all these powers, he was the perfect one if you ask me but he just was stupid.
If Minato had the same abilities Pein had then I might say Kishi was going a little to far, Kishi made him bring an entire village back to like with one technique and you claim Minato is the perfect one?
@ Kisu, that thing you call proof is a load of crap! Come on, in that same piece of so called proof, the Hachibi wondered why he went so far against Sasuke when he really didn’t have to. We know for sure Minato took on not only the Hachibi’s bijuu dama but also the Kyuubi’s and battle them both single handed, he didn’t even take Sasuke serious at all but Minato he clearly didn’t underestimate him.
Clearly Kishi has not made it clear how strong Minato was and that’s something that has to be done if we are going to really get pass this discussion.
I used to like Minato alot but like the guys said….he has become a Gary Stu!! Aint gonna lie dude has some pretty hair tho! lol As for the FTG technique its very cool but show me some of his other skills!! Show me Minato in a full scale battle where he displays some taijutsu an other ninjutsu- its like he’s a one trick pony and that gets boring very quickly!! He’s still badass though but he must have got his ass handed to him at some point!!
Aint gona lie the 4th had some pretty hair, lol He is a total badass but he must have got his ass handed to him at some point!! Also enough with the FTG tech already!! Its like he’s becoming a one trick pony, show me minato in a full scale battle where he shows some taijutsu or some other ninjutsu! To get to Kage level you must have had a bunch of fights and got your ass beat quite a few times- a perfect character isnt very entertaining
(Sorry for the double post- the site flopped and didnt display my 1st one so had to type it again!)
@ debate – What I like about Minito is he used any tech with a awesome precision, unlike Naruto who needs bigger and bigger jutsu, Minito seemed to focus on perfecting the ones he had…
Problem I have with Minito is this “perfect” ninja ideal, he was fast and strong and could easily take out armies and now it is shown he is more powerful then A. Which is fine teleportation is awesome and fast BUT! now the Minotards will say he is greatest ever, he made A look like a joke, he was so much slower, honestly fan warp the perspective of their fav characters and so far Minito has no flaws, he was a powerful ninja with a heart, intelligent, quick, strong, etc….
Here is a quick study…
Minito vs Pein
Minito vs Current A
Minito vs 1/2/3rd Hokage
Minito vs Sasuke/Itachi
Minito vs Naruto Sage/Kyuubi
Minito vs Kakashi
Minito vs 5 Kages
If you said Minito would win all these battles then you a Minotard 😛
nins like pein that can wipe out a whole country and still bring them back from dead …. isnt that compared to what jesus did…. the fact that minato doesnt have a scratch now makes him a god … meanwhile… pein is human …right?
yellowflash and nicholas sed it all….
kisu… i told u.. even if u hate a character…. give respect to what they are abt.. and stop blamin kishi… u cant do any better… if u can.. u would be writing the story now.. not kishi..
i love pein too and respect him alot….. infact i wish i had his techs, so i can bring pple i care abt that are dead …. but i wont condemn him cos kishi makes him the baddest guy and leader of akatsuki… simple as that.. the fact he has never lost any battle means he is highly rated and he deserves it, cos we all know he is strong, minato is somewhat similar….. always look at arguments as the naruto manga decides.. not take things out of context…
@pein.
First your comparison amongst current ninja is unfair. Mostly because if minato had never died he too would have had 16 more years to improve. If he was the strongest then it stands to reason after 16 years he would only improve.
Secondly ofcourse he used precision in his known techs. We have only seen him use all of mayby 4. Naritos abilities are plenty precise. He is perhaps the best shinobi ever with kage-bunshin. Not only can he use rasengan but he perfected it to a level even minato couldnt do then perfected even further. On top of that he mastered sage tech to a level even the sannin jirayia couldnt muster.
Now ill be the first to say minato is overexposed and naruto needs a bigger variety of jutsu. But as far as the jutsu he does use he has surpassed basicly everyone else.
@pein0avenue
nice study lol
minato vs pain – hmmmm, pain let’s him self too much on he’s PAIN, yes pain would beat naruto if he got serious from beginning but minato is something else
minato vs raikage – that would be interesting if raikage had both hands, currently no
minato vs hokages – 1,2 minato wins, 3 hokage in he’s prime would be the toughest – a draw
minato vs sasuke/ itachi – sasuke (as we have seen him till now) would get he’s ass kicked over and over again, but itachi (im thinking about serious itachi and not the one who fought vs sasuke) would be a macth i would wanna see
minato vs naruto/kyuubi – well minato of course, naruto would hold better than sasuke lol
vs kakashi – minato
vs all 5 kages together – well 5kages of course
oh.. and we no one has a problem with the fact that tuchikage can fly…. we talkin abt sumone who can move well with precision and good reflexes
@ minato vs kakashi – kakashi would hold he’s ground for a while, but he get’s exuasted too fast, he’s biggest problem is he’s stamina and chakra reserve, just a little bit of that and he could hold he’s ground
minato vs sasuke- sasuke would win that imo, i dont see how minato could get around susanno and against Itachi, i dont seeing him breaking Tsukoyomi.
minato vs raikage- minato would out smart him- as fast an strong as he is, he is not a tactical fighter and someone like minato could easily exploit that just as easily as madara did at the kage summit (that scene where he teleported out of the way still makes me laugh)
minato vs pain- this is tough one- very hard to call
minato vs kakashi- minato easily, you would have thought by now kakashi would have overcome his stamina/chakra reserve limit
minato vs hokages- this is a sticky one, why does everyone think that the 1st hokage would lose??? 1st hokage was a beast in battle apparently although we’re still waiting for the madara vs 1st hokage flashback… 2nd hokage as well was a don and wats this about the 3rd hokage was so strong??!!! 3rd hokage vs 4th hokage- minato’s got that in the bag imo
“ome on, in that same piece of so called proof, the Hachibi wondered why he went so far against Sasuke when he really didn’t have to.”
Killerbee said Sasuke was the strongest after his talk with the Hachibi. He was essentially saying “Yeah that’s all good, but that gay ninja is probably the strongest guy I ever fought”
“nins like pein that can wipe out a whole country and still bring them back from dead …. isnt that compared to what jesus did…. the fact that minato doesnt have a scratch now makes him a god … meanwhile… pein is human …right?”
That’s the thing. Pain was supposed to be god-like in power and he had the Rinnegan so his power is believable even though he’s so overpowered. Minato is supposed to be a normal high-level ninja, yet he looks even more godly than Pain did.
@ my own study –
Here is a quick study…
Minito vs Pein
Pain would win since he is above life and death, there are 6 paths so even with minito’s speed Pein being serious would have no blind spots.
Minito vs Current A
– Minito, Raikage is good but too rash and will end up being hurt because of it, but we haven’t seen Raikage in a proper battle where he didn’t have feelings involved…
Minito vs 1/2/3rd Hokage
1st – Look if he is able to defeat Madara etc I do think he would be an even match i say a draw
2nd – Oddly enough if the 2nd was cold and ruthless he would be able to beat minito, with Edo Tensai etc, plus that black world thing…
3rd – not sure, think Minito
Minito vs Sasuke/Itachi
Sasuke – Minito will win, Sasoona will keep Minito out and Minito will be able to dodge anything Sasuke can throw at him, Sasuke will tire out first I think.
Minito vs Naruto Sage/Kyuubi
Naruto, in speed he will almost be a match and he will be have a lot more in reserve, basically whoever is able to hit out first here.
Minito vs Kakashi
Minito easily unless Kakashi gets lucky.
Minito vs 5 Kages
– Muzikage, Minito, easily
– Tsuki – Not sure, at current form, Minito for speed
– Kaze – Gaara would do well but again it will become a waiting match, but gaara could win with ultimate defense
– Hokage – Tsunade would loose
– Raikage – already dealt with…
Thing is, if you want to compare from back when Minito was alive I think Pain would of been 10 or so, so we need to have them at their prime or when we last saw them.
Ok so
Itachi > Minato
Reason being is if itachi was not the truly amazing person he was he would have jerked sasugeys eyes out, implanted the EMS and beat madara himself.
But he chose to give sasuke the chance just like minato did with naruto.
But minato fought Madara and the Kyubbi so he is still top 3
Everyone can say what they want about who is stronger, but the bottom line is if Minato was still alive there would be no war going on right now.
Sry for triple post but
Minato = Shanks
@ Pein0avenue, Pein would be able to detect him with his Rinnegan but it doesn’t mean he has the same speed level as Minato. It’s just like the Sharingan, Sasuke could see and sense Lee’s movements when they fought but he couldn’t move at the same speed level to defend. I can think of lots of ways Minato could counter every path of pain. There’s no way Pein could win.
When it comes to the Hokage’s we haven’t really seen them all at their prime in a full fledged battle so I can’t really say, but we’ve heard many times that the Fourth was the strongest Hokage and ninja to ever come out of the leaf, those aren’t my words that was in the story.
I think he could have taken down the Third but I don’t know about the First and Second. Maybe it’s a draw.
I also think he can take down the MizuKage, Tsunade, Raikage and Gaara, but the Tsuchikage may be a match for him. I still wanna know more about the double-bloodlimit or whatever.
I’m not even going to mention Itachi and Sasuke because I think he could mop the floor with them both.
@Roninshinobi
Minato < shanks He's more realistic and cooler.
But that's just me. Also I figured A was older than minato, not by much but still.
For minato vs. the 5 kages and the hokages, do you mean individually or in a group. If it was a group then facing the 5 kages at once, That's already once proven to be suicide. If yall think its because of sasuke did it, shit if itachi at full power and no sickness tried something like that, the results would've still been the same. And the the first three hokages, in thier primes too, I don't think minato could win that either.
@kisu
You say that Minato is perfect and that’s not fair, but I would argue that he’s just as “flawed” as the Raikage. You (and some people in the ninja world probably) would have considered Minato too soft and too compassionate. I would imagine that his level of compassion is probably equal to the Raikage’s impatience. This compassion of course led to the Kyuubi rampaging across Konoha.
So quite frankly, the portrayal of Minato being perfect isn’t true. He has had struggles and Kishi has shown us a glimpse of them. In a way, it is a metaphor for how Naruto has always seen his dad, just in glimpses and as a son thinking about his father, I would say that I idolize mine a bit, in spite of his faults.
As to Minato not being faster than the Raikage, perhaps the Raikage would have beaten Minato in a footrace (without FTG for course), but Minato would beat the Raikage in pushing the buzzer in Jeopardy every time.
“You (and some people in the ninja world probably) would have considered Minato too soft and too compassionate. ”
TOO SOFT!? He killed hundreds of Rock Shinobi in cold blood and was going at Madara with killing intent. He may have made horrible decisions when it came to his family or the village, but he clearly is merciless on the battlefield.
@Yellowflash, joking aside, Minato stands no chance against Pain. Shinra Tensei is an instantaneous, invisible blast that he would have no way of predicting. Pain wouldn’t have to hold back so the moment it begins he could hit Minato with a Shinra Tensei powerful enough to break ever bone in Gamabunta’s body. Minato wouldn’t even know what hit him.
Now lets say he tried to get in on Pain. Remember, Deva Path was fast enough to evade the Rasenshuriken both times it was used and it’s a very fast technique. Deva was also fast enough to react to a charging Kyubi Naruto and was fast enough to outrun him. Human Path was as fast as Sage Mode Jiraiya and Demon Path was fast enough to completely catch him offguard.
Now let’s create a scenario where Pain doesn’t simply hit him with a strong Shinra Tensei. Let’s say Minato gets the first hit in, all Pain would have to do is summon the chameleon and hide Animal and Naraka inside of it. Minato has no way of getting to Animal Path since it would be invisible and Naraka would be able to revive any body that may fall.
In this scenario Deva, Asura, Preta and Human Realm would be on the battlefield and able to cover each others blind spots. Minato’s Rasengan becomes a non-factor when Preta is there to simply absorb it (which he would be able to do since each Pain has shared vision). Minato’s other mode of attack, Kunais, mean nothing since Deva survived being in KN6’s Bijudama and was still able to fight.
Minato also wouldn’t be able to run away from the battlefield since Pain has Chibaku Tensei, which is so large it would suck up any Kunais in the area, so no running away for him. Deva’s full-powered Shinra Tensei would kill him in an instant since he has no way of knowing what it is Deva is doing.
@pein, Nagato would be in his early to late 20s when Minato was alive actually.
@kisu
Based on what u just said about pain vs minato now i know why kishi put nagato in a wheelchair………he’s too damn powerful lol maybe dead demon seal would work for minato…
Pein said that Jiraia could beat him if he knew how his technique worked, so assuming that minato is better than jiraia bayme he could win
@Kisu, Okay when it comes to your little match between Minato and Pein, like always I have to disagree. Judging by how fast Minato broke down Madara’s techniques and countered them within seconds, I don’t think he would have a problem with Pein. I really don’t think Minato would attack an enemy head on without knowing what he’s capable of. I’m guessing he would attack from a distance or send in a clone to gain knowledge on Peins abilities.
Once God Realm used his Shinra Tensei he would know not to attack him head on and if Kakashi was able to figure out the five second interval then I know Minato would. Five seconds it like minutes, maybe even hours to Minato, he could teleport and get right up on him with a Rasengan an destroy him within seconds before any other path can even attempt to act. Not to mention if he messes up an use the full strength of his Shinra tensei and render himself useless. If he does he better make sure he can hit him before Minato uses FTG which I believe he could stop him before he uses that seeing how long it took him to prepare it in the anime when he destroyed the Leaf and how much chakra it takes up and if Pein is smart he would know not to use a large amount of chakra against an opponent like Minato.
See in all those examples of Peins speed you listed, you still talk as if Pein Naruto/Kyuubi and even Jiraiya himself in Sage mode was moving on the same level of speed as Minato.
When it comes to Preta Realm, the only technique I can see him absorbing from Minato is the Rasengan and that is if his reaction time to Minato’s speed level is as accurate. Minato could get right up on his and stab him with a Kunai or beat him to dead. So unless he’s able to get very close to Minato which you’ve said yourself no one has been able to, to absorb his chakra then I don’t see him playing a big factor. Animal Realm is no different, all he has to do is summon toads just like Naruto did to keep him busy while he takes care of the rest.
See when you think about it, it comes down to speed when you are facing an opponent like Minato. The only thing Pein could do is use the Chibaku Tensei but he better do it fast and even then you better be weary seeing that Minato was able to master space/time techniques on such a level, how do you know he wouldn’t just teleport miles away until the technique is over and I doubt Pein could use Chibaku Tensei twice.
Oh yeah Minato also survived a full grown and powered Nine Tailed Fox Bijuudama and apparently he survived the Hachibi’s, so Pein surviving the six tailed Kyuubi blast isn’t that impressive. Also we don’t know if Minato had Sage technique and was able to sense chakra like Naruto how do you know he couldn’t just find Nagato and teleport away and kill him. LIke Bob said, to be able to move at his level of speed and avoid fast attacks like the Raikage’s he had to have some type of enhanced perception.
@Alejandro, Pa Toad had seen and knew what Minato was capable of yet he still said NO ONE could beat Pain without knowledge on him
@Yellowflash, I’ll update this comment later because I don’t have the time right now to give you a full reply, K?
“I really don’t think Minato would attack an enemy head on without knowing what he’s capable of. I’m guessing he would attack from a distance or send in a clone to gain knowledge on Peins abilities.”
You are assuming Minato knows how to make Shadow Clones. He’s never showed that so you have to assume he can’t do it. Also, if he doesn’t attack head on he gets Shinra Tensei’d and dies or he gets Bansho Tenin’d and stabbed over and over with the Black Rods.
“Once God Realm used his Shinra Tensei he would know not to attack him head on and if Kakashi was able to figure out the five second interval then I know Minato would. ”
Big difference here. Kakashi was ONLY facing Deva Path. He had time to think because the other Pains were kinda busy destroying Konoha’s entire military. Jiraiya couldn’t figure anything out once he was facing all the Pains at once. When the Six Paths are together you don’t have time to think, you only have time to dodge.
“Five seconds it like minutes, maybe even hours to Minato, he could teleport and get right up on him with a Rasengan”
Shinra Tensei is an instantaneous attack that can be used without any movement from Deva Path and no warning. The other 3 Pains would all be together so they would easily be able to counter Minato. As for the Rasengan, it gets absorbed by Preta Path. And finally, Minato wouldn’t know about the 5 second interval because he would be actively trying to dodge missiles, summons, invisible (and undetectable) fatal blasts of gravity (which has never been dodged by ANYONE) and trying to not get touched by Human Realm…oh wait, he doesn’t know he shouldn’t be touched by Human Realm lol.
“Not to mention if he messes up an use the full strength of his Shinra tensei and render himself useless.”
Why would he do that? The Shinra Tensei I’m talking about is the one powerful enough to break every single bone in Gamabunta’s body and incapacitate two other giant summons.
If it did that to them, poor little Minato would be broken into little pieces, lol unless you’re gonna tell me he’s physically stronger than all three summons.
“how long it took him to prepare it in the anime”
Pain won’t be using that, but let’s say he does (which would be out of character for him). When he was about to destroy Konoha he gave the order for the other bodies to retreat. He was waiting for them to get out before he blew it away. The moment they were all out and deactivated he activated the jutsu. He was also talking about the will of god blah blah blah. So no, it doesn’t take any longer to use than a normal Shinra Tensei. I also ask this, how would Minato get to him even if he took 1 hour to charge it when Deva can fly?
“he would know not to use a large amount of chakra against an opponent like Minato.”
Chakra means nothing to someone like Pain. He is on a whole other level than everyone presented thus far. He fought an entire army, won, then destroyed that army’s base, fought a Sage, then a Biju, then the Sage at full power again and he still had enough chakra to revive everyone he killed.
“See in all those examples of Peins speed you listed, you still talk as if Pein Naruto/Kyuubi and even Jiraiya himself in Sage mode was moving on the same level of speed as Minato.”
lol no they weren’t. But my point was Pain was able to react to and counter them with relative ease. So why do you think Minato could beat Pain in seconds when he has an instantaneous jutsu, no blindspots, a doujutsu and excellent reaction?
“Minato could get right up on his and stab him with a Kunai or beat him to dead”
HE’S ALREADY DEAD LOL! A Kunai won’t do anything. You have to utterly destroy the body to get rid of it and Minato has nothing in his arsenal to destroy Preta Path. Well, that’s if the other three Pains (Human, Asura and Deva) just stand around and watch Minato attack Preta. And that’s if none of the Pains see Minato come in to attack Preta which is impossible considering just 3 Pains were enough to keep Jiraiya at bay with their shared vision.
“So unless he’s able to get very close to Minato which you’ve said yourself no one has been able to, to absorb his chakra then I don’t see him playing a big factor. ”
Actually, he’s a very big factor. He keeps Minato best and only offense at bay and adds to the shared vision of the Pains.
“Animal Realm is no different, all he has to do is summon toads just like Naruto did to keep him busy while he takes care of the rest.”
How would the toads detect Animal Realm if he is hidden inside the chameleon? And as for what Naruto did, you are assuming Minato has enough chakra to summon 3 Giant Toads when we’ve only seen him summon Gamabunta and it’s a known fact Naruto got his large chakra reserves from Kushina’s side of the family. Oh and those three Toads ended up doing nothing against Animal Path’s best summon (the unkillable dog that gets stronger the more you fight it). Naruto did the most damage to them himself (and Minato doesn’t have Sage Mode so he can’t do what Naruto did). What would Minato do against Animal Path’s Bird summon? Oh wait, I forgot Minato is Jesus so he can fly right?
“The only thing Pein could do is use the Chibaku Tensei but he better do it fast and even then you better be weary seeing that Minato was able to master space/time techniques on such a level, how do you know he wouldn’t just teleport miles away until the technique is over and I doubt Pein could use Chibaku Tensei twice.”
So now you’re saying Minato would run away? Well that would be the only smart thing to do against Pain since he wouldn’t be able to come back to the battlefield now that his Kunais would be destroyed thanks to Chibaku Tensei. And for your information, Pain can not only make 2, but he can make an even bigger one , and that was after he had been fighting for who-knows-how-long.
“Oh yeah Minato also survived a full grown and powered Nine Tailed Fox Bijuudama and apparently he survived the Hachibi’s”
lolNo. Minato teleported the Kyubi’s bijudama away and was not hit by it. Deva Path was IN the KN6’s blast and came out of it with the bruises to show. As for Hachibi, that has never been stated. The difference here is Minato dodged the Kybui’s attack while Pain got hit with it and was still fighting lol.
“Also we don’t know if Minato had Sage technique and was able to sense chakra like Naruto”
Stop Minato wanking. We do know he doesn’t have Sage Techs. He’s never used them either. It’s never even been hinted that he had them. He had the Chance to use Sage Mode when he brought NAruto and Kushina to a safe house, but he didn’t use it because he couldn’t. Are you that unsure of Minato’s odds in this that you are giving him techniques he’s never been shown to have?
“he had to have some type of enhanced perception.”
No. He set up Hiraishin before the Raikage attacked. All he had to do was activate the Jutsu like Itachi did with Susanoo even though he was nowhere near as fast as Kirin.
This place really blew up from when I last commented here… “Oh yeah Minato also survived a full grown and powered Nine Tailed Fox Bijuudama and apparently he survived the Hachibi’s, so Pein surviving the six tailed Kyuubi blast isn’t that impressive” couldn’t help but laugh =p.
@kisuzachi, on June 9, 2011 at 9:38
But when did Minato and Bee fight?? beacuse that what we saw in the last fight wasn´t a fight…. And he said PROBABLY, that doesnt mean that he IS
Jiraiya still pawns all, no elaboration required. You guys really want to head down this road again?Please quit with all this its vacation time.
@kisuzachi
polkas has right, that was not a fight, it lasted few seconds (10-20s), while vs sasuke lasted few chapters, not few pages, and yes bee said probably witch means PROBABLY and not 100% sure……
next time analyze better kishu, donn’t rush with conclusions too fast cuz i’m used too you being thoroughly and accurate in your posts
i agree john 😦
Awww pervy sage was the man!!! Dude loved the naughty things in life- money, women, gambling, drinking and Tsunades puppies!!!!!!!!!!!! Bring back master Jiraiya!!! wouldnt it be cool if he didnt die in that ocean…
@John, my skills have gotten better since the last time we had this debate. 😉
@Yellowflash, as promised, I updated my comment to fully reply to you. Enjoy.
@Tensa, no it wouldn’t be cool. If it turned out he lived he would be a dick for leaving everyone to deal with Pain lol
@kiss
You are forgetting that Nagato has to activate the absorption technique, and if Minato were too fast for Nagato to react, a rasengan would destroy preta path. I admit that Naruto couldn’t do it, despite Sage Mode speed, but FTG is unpredictable and faster, which gives Minato a slight edge.
Also, Minato could probably FTG into Deva realm’s field, avoiding the shock wave.
I feel this needs to be said before continue.
Pain clearly is stronger than Minato. By feats (I don’t need to explain why). By hype (invincible, impossible to beat, akatsuki leader, hasn’t been defeated by any other ninja than main character with a lot of Plot no Jutsu etc.). Also he was the one from two who had enough power to bring peace or destroy the world (that’s the ultimate hype, the other was Naruto, the main character).
Kishi made it clear that with shared vision, you’re not going to be able to touch pain, which is why he made Jiraya and Naruto use elaborate strategies to counter the shared vision aspect.
@ripcord, you are still assuming Minato can detect Shinra Tensei. No one has done that. not even Kakashi with the Sharingan, which can see Chakra Color. And getting in closer puts him in range of chakra rods and soul-stealing so that’s a bad decision. As for Nagato, he’s able to control 6 bodies at once in a war zone, so of course he would be able to control 6 bodies if they are only targeting one opponent.
@Kisu
I know your trolling, but what the hell, lets do this then.Oh well…it begins….and Jiraiya’s death can be attributed to Kishi needing to hype Pain, nothing more. Jiraiya was the standard, what better way to hype up that supposed “God”, who in the end just had a messiah complex and nothing more. Jiraiya was nerfed, not even injured after finishing three of Pain’s bodies, not even tired, put simply nerfed. Pain had to ambush to win, even when having more bodies, cowardice at it’s finest, then again I suppose you can’t put a guy in a wheel chair, getting beat up by a Mega Pervert. 😉 Kishi made it clear that Jiraiya was better than Pain/Nagato. And the way I’ve seen you argue Kisu, your debating skills have gotten weaker since the last time we butted heads, considerably weaker and flawed. 😉 Delusions of grandeur…XD
i doubt minato was older then A because he looks to be around the sannin age and they were much older then minato. either way minato was awesome this chapter
“@Kisu
I know your trolling”
Most accurate thing said here in days harharhar
@Kisu
Self praise? how characteristic of you. 🙂 Denial is such an ugly thing.
Successful troll be trolling. 😉
Here’s something pretty cool. It’s the completed fanimation I posted a few weeks ago. Kakashi fans enjoy
Definetly saving that video:)
“I have no ulterior motives!” lol classic. Good one Sakura! 😉
@kisu: Minato teleported the Kyubi’s bijudama away and was not hit by it.
Teleportation is just ultra high speed, it’s not space/time jutsu, so it would be impossible to do that with teleportation. Obviously he used space/time jutsu, just like Jumper :-). I know that you will look for evidence, so, you can find them in chapter where Naruto, Kakashi, Yamato, Shino, Kiba, Hinata and Sakura met Madara. Do you really think that space/time barrier couldn’t counter Shinra Tensei? You are so in love with Nagato, he is not a God, he is just very powerfull man, but he is not invicible, just like no one is. We still do not know enough about Minato, but with information that we know, I can come up with at least 10 ways to respond to your every theory, and to prove that Minato could win against Nagato. But I will not do that, because when it comes to you it is pointless. Unlike me, you can not accept the fact that Nagato can be defeated like everyone else.
This includes Minato, of course.
@kisu
I’m not saying Minato would beat Pain, but just that he would put up a better fight than you think. There is nothing that says Minato couldn’t use FTG while being hit with Shinra Tensei. Plus, Minato hit Tobi with a Rasengan, catching Tobi completely off guard. It’s true that Pain might not be fooled by that more than once, but perhaps Minato’s speed would be just too much.
@kisu
what you said about pein being so powerful cuz he just got beat by no one but the main character its so stupid and nonsense, that means that any ninja only beaten by naruto is the most powerful ninja??
@Kisu
Those guys had the right idea when making the fight between sasuke and kakashi. Not like the failures making the anime.
I dont know if this debate is still running, but everyone needs to remember that:
1. minato uses kunai to teleport and so;
2. his technique is only as good as the position of his kunai.
Pein’s ability to manipulate gravity, renders strategically offensively positioned kunai mute. additionally, when we consider their match up we also need to consider the fact that Minato and his FTG were well known in the naruverse whereas Pein was an enigma, Minato would not know what hit him, whereas Pein would have the benefit of advanced knowledge. however, even without that, he has neither the power nor the chakra to beat Pein.
Naruto won because:
1. he is the titular character
2. advanced knowledge
3. ma & pa, summoned all the toads
4. he reserved clones on myoukoban (see point 2)
What people need to understand is that villains are meant to be overpowered and Pein was. we needed to see that naruto had grown significantly by putting him against a beast. Minato can follow kunai.
“Teleportation is just ultra high speed”
no. That’s high speed movement. Teleportation is “moving” from one point in space to another instantaneously without actually moving.
@Madzikage, right-o
@Takashid, he caught Madara offguard by attacking him from a blindspot. Pain has none.
“There is nothing that says Minato couldn’t use FTG while being hit with Shinra Tensei.”
If he uses FTG after being hit he would warp to somewhere else still carrying the momentum of the blast. Either way he’s pooched.
@Madzikage though overall I do agree that out of the two pein would come out on top there are things you need to remember as well:
1.minato can use anything and anybody to place his seals on, and he can do it instantly.
2. He can summon the toads as well.
3. theorically speaking, pein’s abilites would and should give him an great advantage and the fact that before the confrontation even jiraya knew him personally knew little to nothing about his techniques so minato wouldn’t know either. But for minato to just simply be puddy in pein’s hands is assuming that pein would have advanced knowledge on minato as well(which i doubt, despite minato’s reputation, most ninjas only knows what he displays, which is a teleportation jutsu with kunais. If jiraya, as well as kakashi and other hidden leaf ninjas didn’t give pein such a hard time that he had to display his techinques, naruto probably would’ve never known how to fight against him, and if he figured out on his own, like jiraya, it probably be too late for him. From what we’ve seen, other than madara/nine tailed fox, possiby A and B, has any outside ninja give minato a hard time like that?)
All I’m saying is, logically pein has minato beat on techniques alone, other things can be debateable. But minato is too skillful a ninja, and too many factors can affect the fight for it to be one sided, one way or another.
I forgot to add that its also assuming(regardless of whatever they knew about each other) that minato would just fall victim to pein’s techniques hook line and sinker uncautiously without any backup plans.
minato has a reputation, so apparently he has or you would assume has plenty of heavy duty fights under his belt apart from the ones we have seen. the seals on minatos kunai is how he can teleport, why cant naruto hold the same sort of seal/contract then he can teleport too, similar to a summoning jutsu. knowledge is the key to any battle, find the persons weak spot and you will win, even, sorry to spur your trolling kisu, pein. i recall pein saying that jaraiya could have bet him. with pein in turned out to be a correct succession of taking out one of his bodies at a time. or occupying his bodies and finding the real nagato and konan to kill. minato was intelligent and fast, i believe the same as with jaraiya, he could have found a way, and minato and kushina would have made a great tag team. i still would love to see more of kushina before her pregnancy and death. naruto needs to grow up and mature and make his parents really proud, sakura needs to go (far away!) and a flashback for A, mmm, maybe his time is up, although i wouldn’t have thought B would be the one…
@ kisu – oh okay, lol had my time line messed up there lol…
@ Yelllow – Think of it this way, FTG is basically just summoning jutsu with kunai, if Pain was smart he would figure out the jutsu pretty quickly, I mean, man throws kunai and appears where the kunai was @_@
With Pain’s shared vision he would be able to see this and with his defense of 6 Dead bodies and manipulation of Gravity. Minito is good and can analyse an opponent quickly but here he is basically fight 7.
So all Pain would do is activate his tech as Minito throws his Kunai pushing minito into the opposite direction momentum would be on Pain’s side the entire match, plus He has a jutsu that sucks the souls out of people….
I am not saying that Minito wont put up a good fight, but I am saying even if he had to beat Pain’s 6 Paths he has no way of eliminating Nagato….
@kisu:
Yes, teleportation is high speed movement, I forgot to write the movement. But it’s not space/time jutsu. It’s impossible to teleport bijudama, you can only jump through space with it.
@ Augutus.. – Teleportation is where matter moves from one part to another without traveling through the space inbetween, as far as I understand it…
Minito does a summoning jutsu thing for his speed, so if you say that is his “speed” then Naruto can move much faster when reverse summoned, the distance cover over the time it takes….
But it also takes chakra to summon himself all the time back and forth, also the Bijudama was transfered matter put it this way..
If there is a wall and you one side of the wall and get to the other in a straight line without going over or under the wall or around it, that is teleportation which is space/time, but if you get around the wall or go through it by disturbing the matter between then it is speed… (of course exceptions for those like Zetsu etc)
@pein, let’s call this one a win for Pain again. 🙂
@ KISU – I thought any character above life and death wouldn’t have to call the win, it would just be obvious. Like Playing the Exodia card in Yu Gi Oh Abridged.
minato has a fleet on sight order on him. That implies that he killed a lot of shinobi, an yet no one’s figured out how to counter him. perhaps ninjas were more pansy back then; I’m certain no such orders would exist these days in the ninja world. also he uses kunai’s for his teleportation because he likes to and it gives him some advantages in fights; the kunai’s are not required for his jutsu.
Also in close combat, it’s nearly impossible to tell the difference between super speed and teleportation, especially if you’re the one whos fighting against someone who can teleport. What seperates them is the DISTANCE one can travel over time with either one, which teleportation blows super speed out the water. the potential problem with someone who can move that fast however, is
thier reaction time. It has to be insanely enhanced in order to benifit over someone with super speed. Also, in minato’s case with his jutsu, he needs to have seals place in order to teleport, which he uses the kunai’s for, But the kunai’s can be countered as well, so serious planning is required for the jutsu itself to be any use.
Btw pein0avenue the wall thing is a poor example considering if a person is at high enough speed, thier molecules would move so fast it could manuver through the still molecules that make up the solid object without disrupting it at all.
(or maybe i’m just thinking too realistically here and it probably doesn’t apply with anime. But if you are at high enough speed, it stops being super speed and becomes space/time, moving on a molecular level. With minato’s jutsu, he simply skips the need to make himself move that fast.)
The thing that bugs me is, that if minato was really manipulating space/time he wouldn’t need the seals to begin with. Someone who’s just insanely super fast would still need a path and direction to travel to. However, for someone’ who manipulates space/time, those things don’t apply to that person.
Or maybe once again, I’m applying real world logic to anime again.
hmm Minato beat the 9tailed… and Pein couldn´t beat the power of 8tails on Naruto..
Ps: and some one like Minatos brain and smart like him wouldnt take long to find out the secret about pein ( Jiyria did it, maybe to late) but minato would figure it out much faster, and the find him and easly kill him ☺ He is the smartet Ninja of all time
so al people who think it´s just about stong technique is stupid..
It´s like saying OOO LOOK AT ME I`M ARNOLD SCHWARTENGGER AND I`M BIG AND STRONG SO I CAN KILL YOU ALL…
@ denka
Pein was depleted of chakra as it was, seening as he used his power to fare against what the leaf village had to offer on his own, not only defeating them, but destroying the village as well. Then he had to face naruto whos at full strength as well as the 8 tailed kyuubi when he only had one path left alive. And even then he held his own against it.
I’d really like to see how fast minatos raw speed is if he’s able to get in fast enough to slap some seals on the pein bodys he can in my eyes take down each pein before they can react, minato was a smart ninja an if he was still alive an nagato was he would already have seals placed in safe places so if he was to face someone like pein an pein uses shenra tensei I’m sure minato can just go to one of those safe places an thats if he’s fast enough to react in time which I say is possible considering what he’s capable of
@pein:
Sorry, English is not my first language, so I’m not sure if I understood you. But for me teleportation is high speed movement from point A to point B across the field, across the sky, across the country, just like power rangers:-). Jutsu that Madara and Minato use is something else, that’s space/time, like Jumper. So, to teleport bijudama you need to grab it and hold it while you are traveling, which in fact is impossible.
@Minatofan: nothing from the manga suggests that Minato has beyond kage level speed-all we know is he was fast enough to save kushina from meda, but naruto was fast enough to save sakura from sasuke so no big deal. we know he can react quickly though. he moves around using FTG which would obviously require a flee on sight order, because it is an efficient, ninja form of killing. we saw on the kyuubi attack flashback tht he already has strategically positioned seals all over konoha and that’s all he needs.
teleportation occurs though either wormholes like in stargate or dematerialisation like in star trek. we just need a consensus on which method is being employed by Minato. I think its wormhole i.e. space is bent from him to a seal and he simply jumps though it. madara I think uses dematerialisation which consequently assists in his ‘untouchableness’
@ Minatofan – Do you think that Minato can take out the entire Konoha ninja force (most of it) including High Level Jonin like Kakashi, get Tsunade down, then take on a full Sage Mode Naruto, with High Level Summons, and then take on the Kyuubi 6 to 8 Tails all the while fighting Naruto fighting not to kill but to injure and subdue, which is a lot harder to do.
anyone over-powered who knew peins secret could beat him. i dont consider pein a god, he was beatable, he had weaknesses. yes he had super human strength, super human chakra, could bring back thousands from the dead. he was god-like but he wasn’t a god. granny chiyo could bring back people from the dead too but she wasn’t a god, she just didn’t have the chakra reserves to do it like pein could. i don’t even consider naruto god-like yet, he will be towards the end but not now. and no, i don’t think minato is god-like either, just righteous, powerful, intelligent, super-fast and gifted.
@ ? – So all u saying is anyone can be beaten, Pain was the strongest in the Naruto universe, Chiyo reviving one dead person at the cost of her life is like a drop compared to Pain reviving a Village that he had actually destroyed himself…. Pain could of revived them and lived if he hadn’t fought for so long
In the end what is a definition of “god”, people literally worshiped Pain, he gave salvation from suffering to his people.
In the end I am not saying worship Pain, I am saying he is stronger then Minato, I believe Pain could take on anyone in the Naruto universe and be equal at least!
pretty much, anyone can be beaten, and we all have our flaws. If chiyo had a larger chakra supply and perfected her jutsu, who knows maybe she could have lived too. but on a more important note, you’re right about the definition of “god”, minato also gave salvation from suffering to his people and we all know konoha and its people literally worshipped minato too, (kishi included) to them he was their leader, no different to pein, except minato, i don’t believe, faltered in his beliefs and didn’t allow others to manipulate him like pein did i.e. following madara, it took naruto to show pein that he was on the wrong path and to correct the wrongs he made and to betray madara. no doubt pein could take on anyone and be at least equal, he whooped lady hokage, we all know jaraiya should have become hokage, he’d beat raikage (he’s a meat head), but any logical, fast, strong, high chakra bearing ninja would have a chance to be equal or sway the odds in their favour. from what i can see minato, would at least have a chance, his tactical expertise is almost as good if not better than shikamarus, and he has the fighting ability to back it up. we have all seen how shikamaru time and again has turned the odds to his favour. at some point i recall somebody talking about minato almost having the ability to predict things, that would be a huge advantage if that is true.
@ ? – Minato was the elected leader of Konoha but he put his family first when he could of lived and continued leading his people, and being the powerful person he is, they would be in a better position now. The 4th Hokage is known as any other hokage. He is known as a Hero not a God, I never seen anyone calling him God but a Hero, the leaf’s “god” is “the will of Fire” actually I believe.
Saying if she or if he had more power then he would also be irrelavant, this is a bit crued but there is a saying “if my aunty had balls she would of been my uncle” its literally u cant be if and buts, either u got it or you dont.
Minato is a good character and I actually thought more of him when he was just a legend. but there are too many times that Minato just knew whats gonna happen and if his calculation was off by a mili sec he would be gone.
@mad actually the raikage himself stated that now that the fourth was gone he is the fastest shinobi…. which means while alive the fourth was the fastest. anyways this whole minato pein talk is gettin nowhere really soooooooo maybe there should be another topic of conversation?? this is a lose-lose convo lol
Itachi with EMS > all ninjaz
I wonder if Madara can do Shinra an Chibaku Tensei now?? I’m expectin sum sick combo’s from that guy
I have a vague memory of kishi explaining minatos ability (maybe it was the anime): The seals aren’t really related to the technique directly, its just that minato moves so fast that he can’t see where he is going, thus the seals serve as easily recognizable anchor points where he can move to while keeping track of his position. Minato doesn’t teleport, he moves at the speed of light. Naruto will surpass him since he will be able to move at that speed soon, but without the use of seals as locators. His kyuubi powers give him extra sensory abilities that cover for the fact that he wouldn’t be able to see. (Einstein theory, if you are moving at the same speed as light, you are blinded since light can’t reach you)
Conclusion:
-Minato moves really really fast, not teleportation
-Seals are only essential to the technique due to the fact he can’t see where hes going, and needs an recognizable anchor point with the aid of a chakra signature.
-Naruto will surpass him thx to the kyuubi
@ IronV
nice theory, sounds very good and from what we have seen till now (at least to me) is the best explanation of FTG
as a quick note on this chapter i didnt notice till now that minato actually almost chopped off one of bees tentacles; impressive considering how thick the tentacles appear to be and that minato only used a kunai
Hey @IronV, nice explanation!! That theory is the easiest to digest so far
@IronV, good theory, but it’s wrong. The manga specifically states Minato’s tags are eseentially a reverse summoning mechanism.
@kisu
I would like to see that passage of the manga, while ill be looking for my passage okay?
http://www.manga2u.com/Naruto/244/16/
Bottom right panel; the translation isn’t 100% accurate from what I remember, but essentially hes saying that the seal act as a recognizable signal for him to use his technique to. That is at least how I interpret it.
I’m looking for all passages where the FTG was mentioned or the seals on the kunai were mentioned. Jumping forward to kushina arc, brb.
@ IronV – It says the kunai alerts him so it doesn’t really state that is where he is teleported too just how he gets there and knows where to be @_@
@pein0avenue
First of all, your english is confusing.
Second, I think you saying the same thing I am, your just reading what I’m saying wrong.
@Kishi again
http://www.manga2u.com/Naruto/501/07/
Madara says its a teleportation technique. 1 point for you, but since it isn’t the man himself saying it, I can’t be too sure. Also, people can easily confuse teleportation and light speed movements.
@ IronV – Sorry English is also my 2nd Language, I see what you mean now, but I do think that it is teleport, since he moved the Blast of the Kyuubi in the opposite direction
Nice theory IronV, naruto is bound to surpass most people including his dad (wouldnt be much of a hero if he didnt) and probably the equal of sasuke
coz we all know kishi wont leave him out lol
bob…minato is definitely younger than the raikage…i think he was just about the same age as Bee…and raikage and the sannins are of the same age..
“You are assuming Minato knows how to make Shadow Clones. He’s never showed that so you have to assume he can’t do it.”
Are you kidding me, you don’t think Minato knows how to use the shadow clone technique!? Every ninja in the Leaf can make a damn shadow clone, except for maybe Guy and Lee. You learn that in the academy, oh come on Kisu, make up your mind, first you call him a Perfect God and now you say he doesn’t even know how to make a clone. Even if he gets Bansho Tenin, he can use the substitution or the body flicker.
“Big difference here. Kakashi was ONLY facing Deva Path. He had time to think because the other Pains were kinda busy destroying Konoha’s entire military. Jiraiya couldn’t figure anything out once he was facing all the Pains at once. When the Six Paths are together you don’t have time to think, you only have time to dodge.”
Did you even watch the fight between Jiraiya and Pein, Through the entire fight, all Jiraiya did was think and analyze every movement and word he said and every piece of information he had on him. This was while they were fighting so get your facts straight. Did you even watch the fight between Minato and Madara, he broke down his entire space/time technique within minutes and figured out he was controlling the Fox and broke his control over the Fox all in the little encounter they had, I don’t think him realizing that the six paths of Pain are nothing but puppets.
“Shinra Tensei is an instantaneous attack that can be used without any movement from Deva Path and no warning.”
Oh and stop with all this instantaneous attack thing, because Minato’s FTG is instantaneous as you saw against the Raikage with he was less than an inch away from his head and he still got away.
“Minato wouldn’t know about the 5 second interval because he would be actively trying to dodge missiles, summons, invisible (and undetectable) fatal blasts of gravity (which has never been dodged by ANYONE) and trying to not get touched by Human Realm.”
I explained that it’s capable to think while you fight because Jiraiya and Minato was seen doing it versus Pein and Tobi, so I know Minato could figure that out. All minato has to do is warp his missiles, summon and the all the paths of Pein away in diffferent locations and divide and conquer by separating and beating them like that. (oh, and Naruto was able to withstand and turn his blasts of gravity onto him so, so much for his perfect jutsu)
“Chakra means nothing to someone like Pain. He is on a whole other level than everyone presented thus far. He fought an entire army, won, then destroyed that army’s base, fought a Sage, then a Biju, then the Sage at full power again and he still had enough chakra to revive everyone he killed.”
And you think chakra means something to Minato, he battled Tobi and the Fox and was still able to split it’s chakra in half and seal away in Naruto and the DDS. Also Minato has taken out armies and battled the strgest of opponents and make them look like weaklings such as the Raikage. Also, Pein didn’t have enough chakra to revive everyone in Konoha, that’s why he died!!!
“But my point was Pain was able to react to and counter them with relative ease. So why do you think Minato could beat Pain in seconds when he has an instantaneous jutsu, no blindspots, a doujutsu and excellent reaction?”
You are proving my point, yeah he could do that to them based on the fact that they don’t have the same speed level but he could do that against Minato because Minato simply moves faster and could hit him before he tries to avoid it. Minato also has instantaneous jutsu, he could counter the blindspot thing with his speed just like Lee did Sasuke and Minato has his enhanced perception and incredible reaction as we’ve seen.
“HE’S ALREADY DEAD LOL! A Kunai won’t do anything. You have to utterly destroy the body to get rid of it and Minato has nothing in his arsenal to destroy Preta Path. Well, that’s if the other three Pains (Human, Asura and Deva) just stand around and watch Minato attack Preta. And that’s if none of the Pains see Minato come in to attack Preta which is impossible considering just 3 Pains were enough to keep Jiraiya at bay with their shared vision.”
A kunai would do anything, look at the damaged he caused the eight tails tentacle when he sliced through it, it almost kunai it off, so you don’t think he could do that to one of Peins bodies, that’s already dead as you pointed out? Also you say Minato has nothing in his arsenal to defeat Preta path? how about brute strength, he could drop a giant toad on top of him. Also Preta path has to activate his absorption jutsu, Minato could hit him with a Rasengan before he does that. And the other paths will have no choice but to stand and watch because they can keep up with his speed level and I don’t think Nagato would risk all his bodies being destroyed.
“Deva Path was IN the KN6′s blast and came out of it with the bruises to show.”
He did not take on the full power of the bijuudama, he was only hit by the shock wave. If you actually pay attention to the fight, Pein dropped a giant boulder on top of Naruto and it set off the bijuudama and Pein was hit by the shockwave.
The post before is @ Kisu
THE NEW NARUTO’S OUT GUYS- SOMEONE MAKE THE BANNER ON THE FRONT PAGE!!
http://www.mangastream.com/read/naruto/94143801/1
ENJOY
P.S Looks like this its gona be round 2 of the Raikage vs Hokage 100 metre race…!!!
Yellow flash, they know how to make clones not shadow clones mate! theres a big difference!
why has there not been anyone creating a 453 blog?
Nice job taking 5 days to reply Flash. You threw me off because I didn’t know you replied. Here goes:
“Every ninja in the Leaf can make a damn shadow clone”
Clone jutsu is mandatory for every Leaf-nin, however, not Shadow Clone. Clone jutsu is useless against Pain. Minato does not know Shadow Clone.
“all Jiraiya did was think and analyze every movement and word he said and every piece of information he had on him.
I said once you’re facing all 6 Pains you have no time to do anything but defend. Once all 6 came out all Jiraiya could do was put up a barrier and then get killed once he got out. Re-read the fight before you act so certain.
“Oh and stop with all this instantaneous attack thing, because Minato’s FTG is instantaneous as you saw against the Raikage with he was less than an inch away from his head and he still got away. ”
What does FTG have to do with this? Shinra Tensei is undetectable! You can’t dodge what you can’t perceive. The Sharingan couldn’t see it, Sage Mode Naruto couldn’t sense and dodge it, so Minato definitely wont be able to react to something that they couldn’t even perceive. I don’t see why this is such a difficult concept for you to grasp. You saying Minato can dodge Shinra Tensei is like me saying I can dodge radiation.
Now Hiraishin instantaneously moves Minato to where he wants to go once he activates the jutsu, however Shinra Tensei instantaneously hits whatever target he aims it at. See the difference? Once Pain aims it at Minato he WILL be hit because he won’t be able to activate Hiraishin because Shinra Tensei is instantaneous AND undetectable.
“I explained that it’s capable to think while you fight because Jiraiya and Minato was seen doing it versus Pein and Tobi”
Pain>Tobi. Once all 6 Pains came out Jiraiya literally had no time to think. All he could do was dodge. Read the damn fight over.
“All minato has to do is warp his missiles, summon and the all the paths of Pein away in diffferent locations ”
Other than wasting his chakra, what would that accomplish? Animal Path can simply re-summon them lol. And let’s not forget Nagato can also summon the bodies back. But let me ask, how will he teleport the bodies away when they have shared vision?
“oh, and Naruto was able to withstand and turn his blasts of gravity onto him so, so much for his perfect jutsu”
Yes, KN6 Naruto repelled a weak Shinra Tensei. Naruto summoned clones to keep him from being destroyed by Shinra Tensei, but do you remember Pain HAS to hold back against Naruto? If he used a Shinra Tensei as powerful as the one he hit Gamabunta and the other 2 with Naruto would’ve died since he wasn’t in Sage Mode.
“And you think chakra means something to Minato, he battled Tobi and the Fox and was still able to split it’s chakra in half and seal away in Naruto and the DDS.”
Don’t you read the manga? All Minato did against Tobi was Hiraishin and Rasengan, or are you saying Minato has Nagato-level chakra? Sarutobi was almost dead when he used Shiki Fujin, so I don’t see the point you are trying to make.
“Also Minato has taken out armies ”
lolno. Minato has killed Iwa battalions, not the entirety of the Iwa army. Don’t be ridiculous. It’s a FACT however that Pain destroyed Konoha’s army.
“Also, Pein didn’t have enough chakra to revive everyone in Konoha, that’s why he died!!! ”
Duh genius. The fact that his jutsu worked meant he had enough power to use it. And this comes after having fought an entire war by himself.
“yeah he could do that to them based on the fact that they don’t have the same speed level”
So you’re saying 6 Tailed Kyubi is slower than 3 tails Hachibi? Whatevs. The whole point of me saying that is Pain has shown that simple speed won’t catch him off guard.
“Minato simply moves faster and could hit him before he tries to avoid it.”
What the heck are you not getting? Shinra Tensei requires no movement whatsoever so Pain can easily kill Minato if he comes in close, and all the other bodies have to do is watch.
“he could counter the blindspot thing with his speed just like Lee did Sasuke ”
Seriously, reread the manga. The sharingan only let’s the user see what’s in front their eyes. That is why Lee got the jump on Sasuke (Sasuke didn’t even have 3 tomoes back then), because Sasuke couldn’t keep track of him. Lee can’t beat Neji because Neji can see almost 360 degrees, but even Neji has a blindspot. The Rinnegan has NO blindspots. What are you not getting. Altogether there are 12 eyes looking in all directions. Speed won’t don anything here.
“so you don’t think he could do that to one of Peins bodies, that’s already dead as you pointed out?”
Dude, how the hell would Minato even get to the Pain bodies when they can see everything going on on the battlefield. What you are saying makes absolutely no sense. All it is is Minato wank. Pure blind Minato wank. It’s freaking obvious that Kishi made Pain stronger than everyone before.
“how about brute strength, he could drop a giant toad on top of him.”
And I’m sure all the Paths will just stand there and let it happen. In fact, I’m sure Naraka Path won’t even bother reviving him. I’m also sure the Pains will allow Minato to summon something above them.
“Also Preta path has to activate his absorption jutsu, Minato could hit him with a Rasengan before he does that. And the other paths will have no choice but to stand and watch because they can keep up with his speed level and I don’t think Nagato would risk all his bodies being destroyed.”
Are you blind to the manga, or do you choose to be so you can get your boner off of Minato? What did I say about Shinra Tensei? It’s the perfect counter to Minato. Also, once Minato Hiraishins close to the Pains (lol lets assume the Pains allow a teleportation Kunai to get that close to them) he’ll have to move using his own speed instead of Hiraishin. We’ve seen his speed is nothing compared to the Raikage’s so why wouldn’t Pain be able to react when he was able to outpace Jiraiya and Kakashi? Come on bro, stop your incessant Minato wanking. It was cute back in 09 with that epically cool Minato fic of yours, but your wanking has just become annoying now.
“He did not take on the full power of the bijuudama, he was only hit by the shock wave. ”
So the shockwave burnt off his cloak? Come on bro. You saw how close KN6 was to Pain when he set off the blast, and you saw how large it was. Pain WAS caught in the blast but he survived. Minato has nothing powerful enough to take out Deva Path.
There is a reason Kishimoto made Pain a “god”. He is above the level of every ninja thus far. (Sage of Six was not a ninja) Yellowflash, please before you reply, read the manga.
@Yellowflash, you say so much about Minato attacking, but what of Pain’s attacks?